First anytime a mans name is attached to a system of theology my antennae go way up, think Campbell, Calvin, Arminius, Smith etc. I commented that some of the teen girls were dressed entirely innappropriately with tiny shorts, which were very immodest, so there certainly should be a standard for modesty. I immediatley thought that my God must be alot bigger than his. Other churches founded in New England and in the Middle colonies were the actual mother churches of modern Baptist churches as these churches were responsible for starting other churches. Fundamental Baptist use the name in its strictest sense as meaning holding to the fundamentals of the New Testament teachings without error. The over the years the growth of so many false and idolatrous practices caused some within the Catholic church such as Martin Luther to rebel, and to try to reform the Catholic church. These people give Jesus and Christianity overall a black eye every time they go to a military funeral or any other event they have absolutely no respect for. Independent Fundamental Baptist churches have fellowship one with the other and often cooperate in such things as evangelism. In Amsterdam, he with Thomas Helwys and thirty six others formed the first Baptist church of English people known to have stood for baptism of believers only. It is also true that we have a responsibility to tell people about the gospel message, especially those who we have contact with. HARVEY ND 58341 (701) 324-4415 CH/HM. He then began to ask me questions and we had a good conversation centered around God from there on. These churches patterned themselves strictly after the New Testament example, and this made them valid churches approved of God. Thomas Gould, died in 1675 an untimely death, partially because of his having his health broken by several long imprisonments. What does this have to do with our discussion? King James, Fundamental, Independent Baptist Resources. What gets my goat on this style of preaching is that as much as these baptists act as though they follow nothing but the scripture, it seems they dont read it or study it much. I hear a lot that the IFB has strict dress standards. Lynne, The more and more that I looked into it and studied the scripture, I realized not only were they wrong they were *completely* wrong about tithing, in fact, they didnt have a clue, and this was the standard teaching throughout the IFB. The way a Christian dresses should be governed by their love for Christ and other people, not by rules imposed by a religious authority to make one look righteous. God has not entrusted that authority to impart salvation to any man or church. From a Calvary Chapel web site: We do not maintain church membership; You must be born again spiritually to join the church of Jesus Christ, therefore membership is in the whole church of Jesus, not just our local fellowship., This practice stems from their Moses model (top down) style of church leadership. He was talking about ceremonial law not moral law I think you are confusing those two. I admitted, in my comment, that I was somewhat caustic in my writing (I could definitely get better in that department) but I re-read what I wrote and didnt think it was horrible. All systems of hierarchy set up by man over the authority of the local church has lead to doctrinal errors and corruption without exception and God has not party with them. However, let no one think little of the name of Baptist for it is the name that most has identified those individuals and churches who have uncompromisingly stood on the Word of God. I would prefer just wearing casual clothes like I do just about every time. We are not under law, but under grace. Those good Church of Christ folks, I have a few friends in that faith, good folks, but as youve so clearly pointed out, completley out in left field as it relates to musical instruments in the church. Have been over twenty years, and have attended probably ten or more IFB churches here in Ohio and elsewhere, and I have never met an IFB pastor who didnt include scriptures from the Old Testament as well as the New Testament, in his sermons. Founded in June of 1980, International Baptist Missions is a ministry of Tri-City Baptist Church. If that membership does not disqualify us I would say that we qualify as true baptists under your definition of the term. It shows Gods promises to us and more importantly it shows us Gods fulfilled promises to the church. I think it is true that God certainly does choose people and draw them to Himself. These first Baptist churches formed in England were Armenian in theology, which taught that all men could be saved. NoI simply believe we are not required to tithe (like keeping law) but it is a good thing to if one wants to. Fundamental Baptists are strict in interpreting the Bible in a literal sense. Churches dont have the right to make rules about dress apart from Scriptural guidelines and principles. Again, its not about how we dress, but about who we are. There are a number of other wrong teachings w/in this church but the false teaching about baptism is far and away the biggest, some of the others are, not believing in eternal security, and close behind is not believing that one can know that you are saved. I still attend a tiny (20-30 on Sunday) Baptist Church, and yes it is IFB. Is this really what youre doing here? Wives Submit Deception Revisited Exploration of Ephesians 5:21, 74. Modern church history is irrelevant, not only to our topic but to us in general. Puritan churches persecuted the Baptists in America until the U. S. Constitution was made the law of the land in 1787. I have gone to Dayspring in Wisconsin and Hillcrest in El Paso and both have apps if you want to check them out. Make no mistake though baptism will never save anyone! Desire your best & healing in Lord Jesus if not. But I also would agree that just about every other Church denomination has strict dress standards as well. I have spoken to my pastor about this, and he insists that its fine for me as a parishioner to come as I am, but he as a pastor should be dressed alittle better, I told him if that is a personal conviction that is fine, but did he have any scripture to support that, of course he didnt. John 10:10, Martin Luther until his death held to this false sentiment and disputed with the Swiss reformer Ulrich Zwingli (1484-1531), over the matter. @bob Dress codes are not the problems. Any idiot can do that. We must agree with John Smyth, the true New Testament church is founded on its belief and practice of the Scriptures, and not on any outward succession of a visible or invisible organization. Some IFB are good fellowships, some Plymouth Brethren Open) are good fellowships..etc. My Sunday school teacher and I have discussed the music issue and we both agree that there is nothng wrong with contemporary Christian music (I do believe some of it lifts up flesh rather than Jesus, though). . Suppose an airplane flew over some isolated country that had no past or present contact with anyone else in the world. Ok how about some peace Blessed are the peacemakers I apologize for my abrasive writing style and did not purposely write to offend you, but make no mistake, someone can be dunked until they know every minnow by name, but that doesnt make them saved. Assistant Pastor of Fellowship Baptist Church in Watertown, WI since 2017. Or, I hope that youve beaten your children today, 13Withhold not correction from the child: for if thou beatest him with the rod, he shall not die. Examine any church in light of these five distinctive it will be shown if they are true historical Baptist congregation which is synonymous with what is a true biblical New Testament church. In 1631, he arrived in Boston. Thank you for writing back. -What about the Jerusalem Council in Acts (I believe I am using the right title here, but I have not check my accuracy)? In recent years the news media has called doctrinally unsound church such as the Charismatics and Pentecostals fundamentalists. How would the IFB Churches differ from other churches that teach first century, new testament doctrine? None of us that I know of follow his every word like it was the Gospel truth. We all make mistakes, the only thing we can do is apologize and attempt to do better. They do not find support in the Bible for such a requirement. Proverbs 21:24, Proud and haughty scorner is his name, who dealeth in proud wrath. Even some TV evangelists have referred to themselves as being fundamentalist. Adulterous generally hide their actions. Its so good knowing that we have an advocate with the Father that helps us to do that very thing. The first is the United Church of Christ and secondly is the one I refer to, Independent Churches of Christ. G.L. Its so important to ask Gods help in forgiving themotherwise satan can get a foothold. In fact, no church on earth can make that claim. I have never believed in obedience to a pastor just obedience to Gods Word The Independent Baptist believes that to join with churches who teach and practice false doctrine is condone and even show approval of Biblical error and that all doctrinal error is sin. My study of the word psalms is that it includes singing with a musical instrument. They write new content and verify and edit content received from contributors. They would probably be allowed in this Church though called Ivor Church: - Truth and Song I recently read an article essentially asking this same question, What's Wrong With the Independent Fundamental Baptists? Some formed new churches and called themselves Baptists to make it clear that they believed and followed the New Testament. THE BEGINNINGS OF THE BAPTISTS IN AMERICA. Youve done nothing to, directly compare doctrine and practices using scripture to make the assertion which is correct.. Each year members profess 16 articles of faith that include the original five points of fundamentalismthe literal truth of divinely inspired scripture, the Virgin Birth and deity of Christ, substitutionary atonement through Christ, the Resurrection, and the Second Coming of Christ. Baptists, including IFB Baptists, are all deceived. Shortly after that, because of his doctrinal preaching, he was forced to leave Salem and went for a short time to Plymouth. Im surprised but shouldnt be by now that folks know so very little about their respective churches/traditions, most just sit in the pew and simply repeat what their pastor has told them, never checking and studying for themselves, what thus saith the Lord You act so surprised that I questioned you about which Church of Christ you were referring to, do yourself alittle favor and have a look at wikipedias lists of Churches of Christ First and foremost I wanted to make sure you werent referring to the The Church of Christ of Latter Day Saints which is a flat-out cult. I made a very similar forgiveness plea on facebook just yesterday, asking all to forgive me if I had ever legalistically stepped on them. Other Anabaptists groups were in gross error and corrupted. Matthew 7:1&2, Judge not, that ye be not judged. Tithing is no longer a requirement and God doesnt not require a tithe for obedience as is preached in todays churches. Particular Baptist had their beginnings around 1616, when some dissenters left the Church of England and were lead by the Rev. There are no rules about what to give at all. Romans 1:20 says that For since the creation Gods invisible qualities his eternal power and divine nature have been clearly seen, being understood from what has been made, so that men are without excuse.. Because Knolleys refused to baptize infants and preached against it he was banned from the colony by the famous Puritan governor Cotton Mather. She and another church lady had this discussion and the other lady said that to her it is a bigger sin to stay in an abusive, unloving marriage such as the one my mother was in, and I agree whole heartedly. 13:8-10). Though many people including Websters Dictionary refers Baptists as being Protestants, it is not correct to refer to them as such or to lump all non-Catholic denominations in one group and label them Protestant. Member churches are forbidden to affiliate with any denomination, and the fellowship, administered by annually elected trustees, cannot organize itself as a denomination. You people are idiots, You cant have the new testament without the old, Christ believed in and followed the old testament, this is why it says he was betrayed on the passover, because he kept the passover and all the other commandments that are in the old testament. Our Beliefs JESUS CHRIST Jesus Christ is at the center of everything. For example inn Isle of Wight county in southeastern Virginia, Baptist preachers were taken to Nansamond River, nearly drowned by Episcopalians to show their contempt for Baptists beliefs in immersion and their rejection of infant Baptism. About this time the Puritans were also becoming strong in England. Everyone in the colony was automatically a member of the State church and were taxed to support it. The center of Baptist activity in the colonies was in the Philadelphia area, and Baptists held regular general meetings of the churches for devotional and evangelistic purposes there. So many churches have lost wonderful ministry opportunties by turning away those hurting, divorced folks, its a shame, God help us all to be sensitive to those who are hurting all around us. Tithing was never required for anyone except Jews who lived under the Mosaic economy. Our Pastor teaches that Baptism does not save us and is no a requirement of salvation. My statement about folks not studying and just sitting in the pew and listening to the MOG, was not addressed to you specifically, but to folks generally, you wouldnt agree to this? Select worship style. My brother attends an IFB church. Well last night the first speaker, spoke on Hell, he said not many preach on Hell anymore (yea, right!) We can clearly see the Spirit of God in your gracious post. Again adhering to correct doctrine and proper practices should be the focus in our lives. Thanks for your response. Thats kind of like being an American and never knowing enough about the nations beginnings to be able to make an intelligent decision about whether some politician is leading us away from freedom. KJV Independent, Fundamental Baptist Churches in the USA I began my spiritual walk with Jesus studying the New Testament, but my journey through the Old Testament only reinforced my belief in the New and showed me more about God. This charter was the very cornerstone of American religious freedom! God uses us, to the extent that get out of His way. Filter Churches. Thus, resolving to follow the Lords commands in truth, in March, 1639 he formed the first Baptist church on American soil. Please note that this presented no problem for this first Baptist church in America. Hope that last wasnt too much personal info. It was not founded because a line of Baptist churches down through history. He then begins crying, Im not an expert at body language, but it certainly seemed contrived, preachertainment some would call it. What does the Bible say about the way Christians should dress? PEOPLE are the problem! If I wanted to wear a sponge bob costume while leading worship I probably would not be allowed to do this in most Churches. You will find, to the left, a tags cloud as well as a category drop down menu. 2 Timothy 2:15, Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth. In 1678, shortly after the church had erected a new building, the Puritan controlled government nailed its doors shut and forbade anyone under penalty of the law to enter or worship there. Spencer Smith on Instagram: "I was saved at 18 at an independent I went on to share with her that in that same passage it says, singing psalms, hymns (which by the way modern churches are throwing out) and spiritual songs. Shall we offer excuses that were only human? @Saved By Grace Many churches by this time had come under the domination of the Rome government and had ceased from being New Testament churches. Not once in the New Testament do you find even a hint that a church was legitimate because it was founded by Paul or called itself by a particular name. Some of these churches have gone so far to even deny the fundamental teachings of the Bible, such as the deity of Christ, the virgin birth and salvation by the Grace of God, through faith. Even if a church blows the interpretation of verses like this and sets up what you refer to as a hierarchy, I feel you are in error to claim that God has no party with them, see for reference the 7 churches in Revelation which had great things going for them, but Christ had to deal with their errors. No words could console. Please elaborate, Should have said of course no singing with musical accompaniment.. In determining who were the first Baptists, you must first identify who you are referring to. By 400 AD, the Emperor Theodosius had declared Christianity the only state religion of the Roman Empire. I usually look fwd to these. Likewiseif a church is teaching its wrong to do sothey are also in error. Any way dont want to lie on any church. In answer your assumptions about me. My question would be: When has anyone ever given 10% to GOD. It more often then none goes to the support building, supplies, salaries of a ministry under the leadership of usually a man., Excellent book on the subject is Should the Church Teach Tithing by Russell Kelly, http://www.truthforfree.com/files/PDF/REK-Tithing3.pdf. Happy shall he be, that taketh and dasheth thy little ones against the stones. Psalm 137:9. either. And this is the will of him who sent me, that I shall lose none of all that he has given me, but raise them up at the last day. When it's Time To Leave Thoughts on Breaking Away, 73. Blessings & againIm so sorry you were hurt like that you & your family. Will you join us? North Dakota Independent Baptist Churches - Tripod Nothing comforted. I respect a church that weloclmes being a part of my tithe but does not mandate that I do. In the many books on church history which make up the bibliography for this paper, there is not one recorded incident of a Baptist church beginning founded out of Roman Catholicism. The heading of the website is true. New Independent Fundamentalist Baptist - Wikipedia In 1688 a Baptist church was organized at Pennepeck, Pennsylvania with twelve members. All Independent Baptist Church The Road to Emmaus Baptist Church - Monaca, PA No Reviews Favorite Claimed? Would you agree with me on this? But not all Baptist churches are that way! He strongly believed in separation of church and state and upheld the principles of soul liberty. I am not trying to be overly critical and yet I only have a certain amt of time to get to my points and while doing that I often come across that way, so forgive me. Personally, I try to for the most part give as I think God is pleased incl supporting Evangelism Ministrys like Compassion (that not only care for childrens physical need but also spirtual vs. the formerly known as Christian Childrens Fund now I believe under the name Child Aide, mainly becaus eCompassion confesses to be Christian & I believe to support church endeavors. Actually what should have been first was the erroneous teaching that water baptism has anything at all to do with ones salvation, it does not! So Im guessing that pretty much every Church other than Ivor Church has a dress code. 8.) IndependentBaptist.com was founded in an attempt to bring back the principles that lifted our movement in the 60's and 70's and that need to be revived in this day. The Baptist church that I attend used the entire Bible, all 66 books. In the simplest of terms a true Baptist assembly is one which follows the New Testament as his sole authority for his faith and practice. Thus the words Independent and Fundamental have been added by many Baptist churches to further identify themselves as truly Bible believing churches and to show a distinction between themselves and Baptist churches who were not following Gods word. Shortly after that, Williams withdrew from the church and became what he called a seeker. History does not record why he would not identify himself as a Baptist. Yes we only use KJV (I perosnally like it better myself because I like the Shakespeareanesque vernacular versus modern but thats a personal choice). They were then tarred and feathered and ran out of the county. Those who put in the effort will be greatly rewarded while those who neglect it do harm to their own souls. If you dont already, try it some time. Just because everyone else is doing it doesnt mean its correct. To say there is a unbroken line or succession of Baptist churches from the time of Christ until today cannot be shown from history. I think that you should go kill your children. It is not the name or the organization that makes a Biblical church, but its practice of the faith as revealed in the New Testament. I heard an absolutely beautiful message, very uplifting, of course no singing, (Btw I like acapella singing, no biblical reason for it though) also didnt talk about baptism that day. America needs great Independent Baptist churches again. Something else to note here, what were they tithing? Its beginning charter reads as follows: We whose names are hereunder written, being desirous to inhabit ourselves in active and passive obedience to all such orders or agencies as shall be made for the public good of the body in an orderly way, by the major consent of the present inhabitants, masters of families, incorporated together into the same, only in civil things.. How can you not see that? Christ suffered and gave His life to save you from hell, it's time you start going to a church that actually believes that. To fulfill something as in Jesus fulfilled the law means that it is satisfied, meaning that it is no longer needed. The ones Ive attend are really good. Fundamental.org - King James, Fundamental, Independent Baptist Resources Comprized of many nationalities and backgrounds, the secret of successat CR, is that this is a Bible Chuch revolving around King Jesus. Even though they may have been uner the law as you sayJesus did not cease sharing the fuller truth of the Law & stretching us to grasp the fullfillment of the Law. The tourists and the police finally separated after hundreds of dollars changed hands. His crime was that rejected the unbiblical ideas of a state church, infant baptism and other false teachings of the Puritans. I love the way David Hayword (aka The nakedpastor) explains some of the problem. Drinkers go to the next town to buy their drinks. (Hebrews 4:15-16 and 10:19-22) Despite his views he was made the pastor of the church in Salem. Not sure where to post this so lets try here. This is the largest christian gathering in the U.S. attracting more than 100,000 last year. Enter keyword. Im not saying thats the case only sharing my experience & by Gods grace I have done so I believe. preaching from the Old King James Bible that you "must be born again" and "Jesus and the Bible come first". Fundamentalist Baptist Church It sounds like you believe that we are not required to tithe, but somehow we are better off if we do? (I do love acapella singing, btw.). It is the clergymen who are affiliated. Hello, For example, we had Dish installed in our home a few weeks ago. Ask these five questions of any church, and if they can answer all five in truth with a yes, then you will have a true Baptist church. You stated that all churches tithe a certain way and used that fact to justify a way of thinking. All but seven were above the Mason-Dixon line. The validity of a church as being a true Biblical New Testament church does not rest in it ability to show an unbroken line of succession from the time of Christ. If you have any more questions or comments (as long as they are not rude), please feel free to email me again. : Yes Address: 1101 Pennsylvania Ave Monaca Pennsylvania 15061 United States Service Times: Sunday School 9:30, Sunday Morning 10:30, Sunday Evening: N/A as of 2/2023, Wednesday 6:30 Phone: 724-252-7885 Pastor's Name: Kevin Draganac That shows your lack of emotional maturity. 4 Reasons Christians Are Wrong About Homosexuality, 63. Some Baptists such as the Landmark Baptist and those often referred to as Our lives reflect the light of Christ. (1 Tim. Filter Churches. Thus, history and the doctrines of Protestantism clearly show that Baptists are not Protestants. LEARN MORE ABOUT THE DANGERS OF THE MODERNIST CHURCH Bob Just want to commend you on how clearly you are able to elucidate on a given topic, Im envious. A true New Testament church bases its faith, practice and authority solely in the Word of God. I attend an Independent Baptist church and Ill answer your questions Enter city. My point (and I just found Scripture) was that Jesus did not disnounce it as badHe says (less I misunderstand) these you ought to have done without leaving the rest undone. @greg Would you say Calvary Chapels are unbiblical and not fundamental? That means every church service must provide a time for people to come to Christ. Every activity, every thing we do, needs to uplift King Jesus, and it must allow for winning precious people to our Lord. I think Calvary Chapel churches are great. This church was not founded on a man, but on the Bible. A new church opened their doors here recently, stating they are an IFB church. After taking in many of their services and listening to the self-ordained Pastor, and now reading this article, Ive come to some conclusions. Your reasoning is faulty. I do hope that your eyes will be opened up soon because keeping the law will not grant you entrance into heaven. teaching that all sex is dirty, etc..), I see no sense in throwing the baby out with the bath water. One of the last acts of the Presbyterians, before the Long Parliament in England fell, was to past a law passing the death penalty on anyone who was caught holding to what they called Eight Errors in Doctrine. These doctrines included infant baptism. This kind of power is frightening to meet with. I love your statement above about The Grace economy I think Im going to have to borrow it. I do dislike what seems to be human effort in trying to do what only the Spirit of God can do through a clear presentation of the word of God. The New Independent Fundamental Baptist (New IFB) Movement It is well to note that not all Virginians felt this way. He believed the only way to recover was to form a new church based on the Bible. But when we begin to paint entire church groups with the broad brush of generalities then OUR motives become suspect. I, for one, am glad you wont post here again after that comment, but I hope you will at least read this, although Im not holding my breath. They should not be confused true Bible believing churches, because their beliefs and practices were much like the Church of England. 4. No new testament christian anywhere in scripture, that I know of, is compelled to give a tithe. Thats NOT in the Bible anywhere! Further, they reject so-called scriptures of modern day so called prophets. Failure to pay the tax brought the wrath of the civil and church leaders and people were publicly beaten, placed in stocks, fined, imprisoned, and banished from the colony by the civil authorities under the direction of the Puritan church officials. Independent Church. Mat 5:17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil. About modesty, my wife and I attended a concert that my sons band performed at a teen group in a neighboring town. The crucial point is not that they called themselves Baptists, but they followed the Bible as their sole authority for faith and practice. They direct their own affairs under the authority of the New Testament Scriptures, free from the outside interference. People sin, and people attend churches. than we pray that they will get right with God A person can rightly take pride in truthfully bearing the name Baptist. It is one made up of baptized believers organized in a local congregation for fellowship, teaching and evangelism. 4) strict obedience to the pastor Independent fundamental Baptist churches include those loosely affiliated in fellowshipsmore common in the Northas well as those whose pastors may share particular networksmore common in. http://www.nakedpastor.com/2011/01/27/total-unaccountable-power/. Im trying to figure out if it was worse of me for not using scripture to answer your question, which btw is not a question that required scripture, or yanking a handful of verses completely out of context as you did. @greg Look at Ezekiel 33. May The Lord bless us, and keep us: The Lord make his face shine upon us, and be gracious unto us: The Lord lift up his countenance upon us, and give us peace. A storm of persecution broke out because these Baptist preached what the Puritans called damnable errors. Most of the members of the church were fined or imprisoned or both, at one time or another. Memoirs of a Recovering Fundamentalist, 55. But this article simply exposes the Baptist system as just another denomination among tens of thousands.
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